“seller’s license”

in previous post, should read –

“seller’s drivers license”

The FFL eZCheck page states that EZ-Check is not a substitute for a signed license copy. The seller may need to provide a copy of the license when shipping also.

My response, no follow-up is required:

A signed license copy is NOT legally required when sending from non-FFL to FFL; so, the statement, although correct, only applies to FFL to FFL transfers. The statement is written poorly; thus, it is interpreted poorly. It is in gunbrokers best interest to ensure the efficient and legal flow of goods.

In my opinion, a non-FFL seller should have the ability to verify the FFL license and shipping address via FFL eZCheck. A printout of the FFL eZCheck information and seller’s license should be sufficient for the shipping package. UPS or other carrier can use FFL eZCheck to verify shipping address and FFL license. Using a faxed copy of a license, which can be easily altered, is more error-prone and susceptible to fraud.

The ATF indicates that the firearm must be declared to the carrier/shipper. That is all that is legally required when shipping a firearm from non-FFL to FFL. The only issue that I have with gunbroker is that it has made a law where there is none.

Here is a response from the ATF EPS Directorate:

——————————
From: EPS Directorate
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2009 5:48 AM
To: CUT
Subject: FW: non-FFL to FFL

The Gun Control Act allows this type of shipment, however many contract carriers have an internal policy requiring shipments between licensees. You need to declare any firearm to the common or contract carrier.

——————————
From: CUT
Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2009 2:36 AM
To: EPS Directorate
Subject: non-FFL to FFL

The FAQ does not answer this question well:

Is it legal for a licensed dealer to receive a firearm from an out-of-state, unlicensed person who does not possess a copy or fax of the licensed dealer’s FFL?

For example, can an unlicensed person solely use FFLeZCheck to verify the validity of a licensed dealer prior to sending a firearm interstate to the licensed dealer?

Sincerely,

CUT

This statement is FALSE because it treats FFL to FFL and non-FFL to FFL identically. They are not the same! Read the law! The ATF clearly differentiates the two types of transactions.

Why?

Does a non-FFL need to maintain the copies/faxes of the licenses? No, they can throw the copy in the trash immediately
Is FFLeZCheck more error-prone or more susceptible to illegal modification? No

Talk to the ATF about partial numbers. They use it for their FFLeZCheck. If it’s not good enough, then why use it? Oh, it’s for verification, because FFLeZCheck contains up-to-date information regarding licensees. Huh…

Also, [in my opinion] a copy of the results from FFLeZCheck should be sufficient to place in the package.

This is the 21st century…faxes aren’t necessarily the best means to verify that you’re sending to an FFL.

As between FFLs, though a faxed copy of the (recipient) FFL’s license is now accepted, you still must obtain HARD COPY–either mailed copy or faxed copy. A non-FFL licensee sender is certainly smart to follow the same guidelines.

The EZ-Check system can be used for convenience, but, as between FFLs, an EZ check search, without more, does not suffice. If the recipient FFL will not mail or fax a copy, you should explain this. Here is a section of the Gun Broker FAQ:

FFL dealer refuses to provide a copy of their FFL license
(last updated on 8/12/2005 12:40:22 AM)

A physical or faxed copy of an FFL license is required to verify that the FFL is valid. The FFL license shows the name and address of the FFL dealer, and that is the only address that firearms may be shipped to and it is the only method that the seller has to determine the proper shipment address for the item you purchased.

Our recommendation is to explain this to your FFL, and if they still refuse you should continue to check other FFLs in your area for one that will comply.

In certain areas it seems that some dealers have made a personal decision to stop providing copies of their FFL to anyone but other dealers, but this is an individual decision and it is not based on any federal or state policy or recommendation.

As stated in the ATF’s own policy, a certified copy of the FFL license is REQUIRED to complete any interstate firearm transaction. The ATF now accepts faxed copies of a certified FFL license, but they recommend that you verify the license using their online FFL EZ Check system prior to shipping an item.”

The ATF FFL EZ Check system:
https://www.atfonline.gov/fflezcheck/

Also from GunBroker FAQ:

FFL License Verification
(last updated on 8/12/2005 9:49:05 AM)

“Federal ATF law requires that you only ship to the address listed on the FFL license and no other address.

You must still have at least a faxed copy of the certified FFL license, the EZ-Check web page is for viewing and double-checking that the FFL license information is correct.”

—

Note, in the above section, we were talking about the duties of a FFL-holding SENDER shipping to a recipient FFL-holder. Those duties are set out in statute and ATF rules. Again–the sender FFL still needs hard copy.

Now–does that apply to a non-licensee SENDER? We are still looking for a particular rule interpretation on this point. But, we CAN say that it violates Federal law generally for a non-FFL-holder to ship a gun across state lines for the purpose of transfer, unless it is going to an FFL-holder. The non-licensee sender does have a duty to establish that the recipient FFL is bonafied.

The business about only checking the partial number is contrary to instructions we have been provided by ATF lawyers who’ve told us that a shipper should determine the actual license number of the recipient, as well as the address.

As a last note, whether you are using USPS (for long-guns) or a common carrier (UPS/FEDEX) for any time of firearm, it is a good idea to make a Xerox copy of the recipient’s FFL license and put that copy INSIDE the box. If the shipping box is damaged, or if the shipping entity chooses to make an inspection, this will help verify that the intended recipient is eligible to receive the package.

This is yet another reason to INSIST on receiving at least a faxed copy of the recipient’s FFL license.

I believe the statement is incorrect. No where in the firearms regulations does it state that a non-licensee must have a signed FFL in hand to ship a firearm and some FFL holders will not give out copies of their license to non-licensees. I have spoken to someone at the AFT and they actually recommend that FFL holders do not send a signed copy to a non-licensee. IF you, as a non-licensee receive a ink signed copy of the FFL, how do you know that it is not a forgery? The best way to check is by using the FFLeZCheck website provided by the ATF. That site makes receiving a copy of the license unnecessary. Here is the link: https://www.atfonline.gov/fflezcheck/

All that is required to do the check is the first three and the last five digits of the license number. The AFT employee that I spoke to recommends that FFL holders give only those numbers to non-licenses. The shipper can use those numbers to check the validity of the FFL and the correct address. Giving the complete number is about like giving ones complete SSN to someone.