Remington Introduces new 30 Remington AR Cartridge
Remington Arms just introduced a new cartridge, the 30 Remington AR (aka “30 RAR”), to be used in AR-platform rifles to be built by its DPMS subsidiary. (Remington, DPMS, and Bushmaster are all owned by Cerberus Capital Management, a private holding company.) The cartridge carries the “short, fat” design to the extreme. It is based on a shortened version of the .450 Bushmaster, which itself was a cut-down version of the .284 Winchester. Like the .284 Win, the 30 Remington AR has a rebated rim, so it will fit a .308 Win-sized boltface (0.473″). While it resembles a 30BR, the new case is much fatter, offering an impressive 44 grains of powder capacity. The portly diameter of the 30 RAR case dictates that the magazine will be a single-stack, and will hold only four (4) rounds.
Cram a Big Cartridge in an AR15 Mag and Make Sure It’s a Thirty
What was Remington thinking? Well, the stated project goal was to transform the standard AR15 into a “legitimate big game hunting platform.” Presumably, a 30-caliber cartridge was chosen for marketing purposes as that is the most common deer hunting caliber. The “science” of the design was basically to stuff the biggest cartridge possible in a standard AR15-sized magazine. According to Outdoor Life columnist John Snow: “DPMS President Randy Luth and Remington’s John Fink (brand manager for the rifle division) … both said that the goal was to look at the AR lower and see how much cartridge they could fit in there.”
30 Remington AR (30 RAR) Specifications
| Case Capacity | Rim Diam. |
Parent Cases | Shoulder | Factory Load | Mag Type |
| 44.0gr H20 | 0.473″ .308 bolt face |
.450 Bushmaster .284 Winchester |
25° | 125gr SP or 125 B-Tip 2800 fps 0.267 BC |
4-Round Single Stack |
Factory 30 Remington AR Rifles and Uppers
Initially, the 30 Remington AR round will be chambered in complete, DPMS-built Remington R15 rifles, which start at $1,199.00 MSRP. For production rifles, the expected rate of twist is 1:10″, but that has not been finalized. What about separate uppers? Given the hefty price of the complete rifle, existing AR owners may prefer to purchase a 30-caliber upper by itself. While no release date was given, Remington stated that 30 RAR uppers will definitely be offered for sale in the future.
Impressive Velocities but Much Less Energy than a .308 Win Shooting 160s
With 44 grains of capacity, the 30 RAR can generate some impressive velocities with bullets in the 120-125gr weight range. Remington claims its 125gr factory ammo will deliver 2800 fps muzzle velocities running at about 55,000 psi pressure levels. Three factory loads will be offered: Rem-branded 125gr Core-Lokt PSP and 125gr AccuTip BT, and a UMC-branded 123gr FMJ. At $18.99 per 20-round box, the UMC ammo is intended for inexpensive practice purposes. The $35.99/box AccuTip and $26.49/box Core-Lokt PSP are much costlier. The relatively light-weight bullets used in the Remington ammo have poor Ballistic Coefficients compared to the longer, heavier bullets typically used in a .308 Win or 7mm-08. The 125gr Core-Lokt has a 0.267 BC, while the 125gr AccuTip is somewhat better at 0.335. Nonetheless, Remington’s ballistics tables show that the AccuTip should match the trajectory of a 165gr AccuTip (fired from a .308 Win), fairly well out to 400 yards. However, there is a BIG difference in energy as you can see from the table below. At 300 yards, the 125gr AccuTip delivers 1153 ft/lbs of energy compared to 1661 ft/lbs for a 165gr AccuTip launched at 2700 fps from a .308 Win. (Note: these numbers were calculated with 24″ barrels. Remington’s 30 RAR-chambered R15 rifle has a 22″ barrel, so its performance should be somewhat less impressive.)
COMMENTARY by EDITOR
Our first reaction to the news of Remington’s new cartridge was: “Why?” The obvious (and cynical) answer is that Remington wanted to sell AR-style rifles to deer hunters who need an excuse to purchase a military-style semi-automatic. There may be a market for that… who knows. But there is already a proven, compact 30-caliber cartridge that fits a standard-sized AR15 lower — the 7.62×39. The 7.62×39 won’t push a 125-grainer as fast as the bigger 30 RAR, but the 7.62×39 will still kill a whitetail plenty dead. Perhaps Remington’s engineers should simply have applied themselves to producing a proper (i.e. 100% functional) 7.62×39 magazine. This Editor has tried most of the AR15 7.62×39 magazines on the market (from 3-rd to 30-rd capacity). None of those I tested worked particularly well. Some simple redesign work (call the MagPul folks) would solve that.
Better AR Ballistics with 6.5 and 6mm Cartridges
If the goal was to produce an AR15 with better ballistics and downrange energy than the .223 Rem cartridge delivers, we’re not sure a 30-caliber was the way to go. The 6.5 Grendel performs exceptionally well in AR rifles, delivering great accuracy with 123gr Lapua Scenar or Sierra bullets. Likewise, the AR15 can be a superb High Power and Cross-the-Course platform shooting the 6mmAR cartridge developed by Robert Whitley. The 6mmAR is the 6.5 Grendel necked down to 6mm. Shooting 105 Berger VLDs it comes very, very close to the ballistics of the larger 6mmBR cartridge, and it gives up nothing in accuracy. By contrast, with its low-BC bullets, the 30 Remington AR is not going to be competitive at longer ranges with either the 6.5 Grendel or the 6mmAR. And with factory mags limited to four (4) rounds, you couldn’t use this gun effectively in High Power matches, even if it proves highly accurate on the short course.
Important Innovation or Another Orphan Cartridge?
Only time will tell whether the 30 Remington AR cartridge will catch on with sport shooters and hunters. We’re not sure the round has an important purpose that cannot be filled by existing, proven cartridges. The complete 30 RAR rifles are expensive ($1200+) compared to a typical bolt-action deer rifle, so we wonder how many deer hunters will actually jump on Remington’s bandwagon. Speaking frankly, so long as the cartridge is available only with Remington-made brass, we predict little interest among competitive shooters. Now if Lapua were to produce a 65,000-psi rated version of this cartridge, THAT might interest hunter benchrest shooters and BR for score shooters. A Lapua 30 RAR would be like a 30BR on steroids. But alas, don’t expect Lapua, or Norma, or even Winchester, to produce 30 RAR brass any time soon.
So, does the 30 Remington AR (aka “30 RAR”) have a future? It will certainly stimulate sales of AR-platform rifles to some extent. That’s important because AR sales have been lagging recently. Perhaps that is enough justification for a new round. All things considered however, we think Remington would have been better off building its “AR for big game” around the 6.5 Grendel case, perhaps in a 7mm version. Still, we have to credit Remington’s designers. Using a modern “short, fat” design, with a rebated rim, they’ve achieved impressive velocities in a very compact cartridge. The chopped-down .284 may prove to be a very accurate design.
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i like the ar-15 style(look),but i also like the .30 cal for big game hunting. so paint this one black and i will buy one
Personally, sounds dumb. I don’t know anyone who hunts with less than 150gr for deer. But we have good size deer in the northwest. Might work just fine on some of the smaller dog size deer in the southeast. I’ve met very few hunters that know how to hunt with a bullet drop like a .308’s or 30Rem. We carry fast 270’s and 30cal’s in our neck of the woods, and get the job done. Thumbs down!
I have hunted and bagged a White Tail Buck with a 30 RAR Accutip in a R-15 XHR. Great round, great gun! Range groups are sub MOA. Load in the 150 grain Corelokt’s in a 10 round mag and it is my Hog killer!
I wonder how many owners of .270 Win or any of the .284″ arms will blithely (blindly?) acknowledge the need for a 150 grain pill for game the size of Mule-deer or smaller. I suspect they’ll be in the minority.
Learning “drop” on a cartridge, even one that’s far less streamlined than the .308 Win, isn’t difficult. It’s just not emphasized. Rifles with trajectories that are not “ultra-flat” don’t make long shots impossible so much as slightly more problematical. The scores of 1000yd matches won in the U.S. in the late 19th and early centuries, in the U.S. and U.K. with the .45-70 and .577/450 Boxer-Henry rifles stand as stark testimony to this assertion.
It IS true that modern cartridges might shoot tighter groups at extreme ranges but bullet drop isn’t necessarily the villain and ever-higher velocities (especially at the expense of projectile mass) are not always answer. Perhaps the real answer is to be found in hunters asking themselves how many of their successful shots simply HAD to be taken at ranges in excess of 250 yards.
I think the need for such a round is probably greater for the military than for any hunter. The rifle was afterall built for that purpose. Also most deer are shot at ranges less than 100 yards. Still it would make an interesting round in a small bolt gun.
J.A.Koss
At first, I thought along the lines of the author: Why? Since I primarily chase the target game, I wasn’t really seeing the light on this one, but since sales of AR15 rifles and carbines have been sky-rocketing among hunters who are looking for medium game calibers in .264-.308, while keeping a lightweight gun, the .30 RAR starts to make more sense.
I just looked up some load data in Hornady’s 9th Edition, and see that they have some loads with 150gr-155gr projectiles in the 2500-2600fps range. When I went to look at the test rifle, I see that it was a Model 70 with a 22″ barrel. That isn’t helpful for the AR shooter.
Since it uses AR10 bolt geometry, it will take a lot more pressure than a .223 bolt. I’d like to see this necked down to 7mm and 6.5mm though. A high-pressure case from someone else would be nice, as mentioned.
4 years later and it seems they are dropping the price on these rifles to get them moving.
Interesting concept! Much like Coopers “Thumper” rifle. Most troops would be outfitted with the 30 rem and snipers or DMR would have 308. Same bullets in each one.
I should point out to the editor that the magazine is BLOCKED at 4 rounds for legal maximum hunting, not that the 20 round AR mag will only take 4 rounds because the case is so fat.
I mean come on Dude.
Further, this would make a wonderful urban rifle, giving more energy at 500 yards (719ftp) than either my 10mm sidearm at the muzzle (654) and most 41 magnum loads.
Starting 200 fps faster than the 7.62 x 39mm it beats the .223 nonlethal (by Army Def.) 500 yard energy by 500 fpe, making it highly lethal. Impressive.
I hunt on a very thick piece of property in northern MS .. primarily growing pines that are 6-8 years old with fingers of hardwoods in between the fields of pines. I primarily bow hunt the property, and all of my stands are set up with bow in mind, but when gun season rolls around I head out to check things out. Problem is that there isn’t a single spot on this 300+ acre piece of property where I could take a shot much further than 75 yards. Every deer killed there in the past 5 years has been taken inside 50 yards. The WSMs have been my first choice for this property because of the small overall footprint and short barrel of the gun …. so a small-profile 30 cal AR out of a tree stand build with bow-hunting in mind seems like another decent option for my situation. I have guns built for long-range hunting, but most are too much for this property. The 30 RAR might be the right fit for me …
The R-25 is also chambered in the 7mm 08. While you’re at it ,include that caliber in this comparison. KL
Compare this with Whitley’s 30 ARX…
Natural selection is going to have to kick in.
$1100 pass. $700 okay. 30 cal 308 balistics? I would like to try it. Hope the caliber makes a resurgence.
Looks like it might be a fun cartridge to play with in a bolt gun on the target range. To me it looks like with the right recipe it will shoot bugholes. Here in Mi I do all my deer hunting with a pump shotgun and a rifled slug barrel. No shots ever over 75 yds and with sabot slugs 100+ is easy to do so I don’t even need a rifle for hunting. I would like to see some range reports on this cartridge out of a good bolt rifle.
Another cartridge no one néeds-lol. Not even worth commenting on.